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I find very disappointing that some people just don't bother writing in english over the Internet (web and other). How many people do you think speak german ? Even if you don't write english well (like me), it doesn't matter, the point is to be understood by the mass...
I'm with jobarr, although I do feel like I'm missing out on what looks like a really interesting article. If a kind multi-lingual evolter could find the time for a translation I'm sure many of us would appreciate it - the
BabelFish Translation
doesn't make a great deal of sense, unfortunately.
This is pretty much what I was afraid was going to happen. We have an English translation, but no one but me seems to want to publish it. One admin mentioned that there may be some technical issues with supporting multiple versions of the same article in the CMS as well.
Sorry for springing this change on you without any warning (other than the synopsis). Admin could have handled this better.
Lieber jan winkler. Du bist doch ein eierkopf !
I´ve had it with German arrogance !! The rest of the world actually speaks English.
How would you feel if I posted something written in Danish in your precious German DHTML-forum ? THINK ABOUT IT !!
In Denmark we are actually forced to learn your language, but we never use it. Why ? Because we don´t live in Germany.
The International language is ENGLISH !
This is not about the war. It´s about respect for your fellow human beings.
Though I´m probably one of the few who were able to actually READ your posting, I found it very good.
www.dhtml-now.de is pretty good too.
See you around
I wrote a letter to the evolt team and asked if it is possible to write in german 'cause writing in english could be difficult. The team said that it would be ok and so i wrote in german.
if you couldn't read this article because you don't speak german, just let it be and look at the other nice articles here on evolt.
and if you want to have an international site then respect others to write in their language.
jan.
Ok, how about writing articles in French ? Here we go : I write mine in french, you write yours in german, pawd writes his in danish... Do you really think that's interesting ? This site is about sharing ideas, experiences. How the hell do you expect sharing whatsoever by writing in german ?
Who reads German? Everyone in Germany (and Austria and a fair chunk of Swizerland). This is a global community, not an American one. It's as appropriate to demand that all content be in English as to demand that it all be in German. It's all good - or it's incredibly egocentric. (American) English is not
the
international language. It's a national language which many people have as a second language - it's perfectly OK that members of the community want to publish in their first one.
The translation we have is a slightly tidied Babelfish one. It was never suggested that that poor translation be posted and I'm sorry that a misunderstanding arose over it. If anyone else feels sufficiently motivated to idiomatically translate into English,
Fran
ç
ais
,
Dansk,
Espa
ñ
ol
and add the translation as a comment, please feel free. No-one suggested not doing that. If you feel that the Babelfish translation is good enough, post that.
I'm sorry if anyone felt that having some content not in their own first language was springing something on them. But of course our members whose first language is not English have had this for some time - publishing one article in another language can hardly be arrogance.
You want to write in French? Rock on. Same for Danish. Same for Icelandic. It might not go up until it can be reviewed (which may require translation), but it's all good.
By writing in German, it shares with everyone who can read German. This is an improvement on
"The article isn't written
".
martinb wrote:
By writing in German, it shares with everyone who can read German. This is an improvement on "The article isn't written".
Sure isn't an improvement on "only English-fluent members can read it" or "only English-fluent and German-fluent members can read it" if we had both language versions.
I really don't see what's so terrible about linking to the English translation we have (even if it
is
just a Babelfish translation that has been modified by an admin fluent in German). I don't see the benefit of blocking out the majority of our members.
I guess if admin was the US Supreme Court, this would be a dissenting opinion.
Thanks, and sorry again. I'm sure this is an excellent article and I wish I could read it.
"janwinkler wrote on 11/30/2001 at 12:36 AM
I wrote a letter to the evolt team and asked if it is possible to write in german 'cause writing in english could be difficult.
The team said that it would ...etc. etc.. "
If that is bad english, my own English must be catastrophic !
How about this :
If someone wants to, they can publish their articles in both "bad English" and their own language.
That way, everyone gets to be happy.
Matt, for the second time: if you want to publish the translation as a comment, there's nothing stopping you. Go ahead, publish and stop complaining.
The decision was that if anyone felt strongly enough about translating an article that they should go ahead and do it. Take some responsibility and do it, rather than demanding that everything be handed to you on a plate.
It's fundamentally patronising and egocentric to demand that everyone else has to publish in
my
language, but to refuse to publish in theirs. This is not an
American
community, but a global one. Read the footer to this page, and think about how unwelcoming you're being to the majority of the world's population who don't have English as a first language.
If someone wants to, they can publish their articles in their own language. If you feel that a translation is important, translate it. If the best you have is Babelfish, that's fine.
This is so wrong. Did you know that a third of the world's population speaks Chinese (Mandarin)?
German is spoken by 118 million people in the world. That's a significant number.
Many people (including me) speak English as a second language. There's a difference between posting a couple of lines in a forum and writing a full-length technical article. Being able to do the former doesn't automatically mean you can do the latter. Don't go off at Jan about his inability to write a full article in English. If he thought that he could produce a higher quality article in German than in English, he made the right decision.
Like Martin said, this article is better off being here than
not
. This way, at least a few German-speaking people can appreciate it. If it weren't here,
nobody
would benefit, and that's not what evolt is about.
>The rest of the world actually speaks English.
And you call the
Germans
arrogant? Your comments are not just arrogant, but also ignorant.
Go read this
.
Send in your French article. If it's good, evolt will probably publish that too.
MartinB wrote:
Matt, for the second time: if you want to publish the translation as a comment, there's nothing stopping you. Go ahead, publish and stop complaining.
There's nothing stopping me? Ok, I guess I'll just ignore the posts on admin saying that we shouldn't?
The decision was that if anyone felt strongly enough about translating an article that they should go ahead and do it. Take some responsibility and do it, rather than demanding that everything be handed to you on a plate.
Wow. We already have a translation. It's not mine. I already have access to it, so nothing would be handed to me on a plate... But, it sounds good the way you misrepresented it, so I guess that's ok.
It's fundamentally patronising and egocentric to demand that everyone else has to publish in my language, but to refuse to publish in theirs.
I couldn't agree more.
This is not an American community, but a global one. Read the footer to this page, and think about how unwelcoming you're being to the majority of the world's population who don't have English as a first language.
Huh? How is having both a German and English version unwelcoming? You have some pretty odd reasoning. From where I'm standing, having only a German version seems more unwelcoming.
If someone wants to, they can publish their articles in their own language. If you feel that a translation is important, translate it. If the best you have is Babelfish, that's fine.
Yeah, I'll say again. We've got one. I wish it was mine, because I'd link to it if it was.
As I am German, I understand everything .ok , i'm happy. If I would post an article, I would do it in english, as I comment my scripts in english, gernerally.
Anyway - You all are just talking about languages, first, or second, english, frensh or dansk.
I think you forgot one major thing: The code, and the Idea to read from text-files using Javascript. i guess you all people familiar with javascript could actually read and understand the code or parts of it.
I think it is totaly unecessary (everthing spelled right so far? ;-) )
I would prefer using other script languages. Server Based! like php or perl. (or asp if you have a windows server).
not just for security reasons. it's just, that f.e. PERL is just made for accessing and manipulating text files. and php comes with such features as well, and is quite easy.. supports a load of databases ... so for what javascript?
------------
GERMAN:
Ihr habt bestimmt alles englische verstanden, oder ihr seid alt und aus der ehem. DDR, oder habt ihr gar die schule nicht besucht? Wird doch bundesweit ab der 5. klasse unterrichtet.... ;-)
------------------
you see, one reason for the janwinkler to write in german is the fact that a complex story can be written in this less text.
//smok
As I am German, I understand everything .ok , i'm happy. If I would post an article, I would do it in english, as I comment my scripts in english, gernerally.
Anyway - You all are just talking about languages, first, or second, english, frensh or dansk.
I think you forgot one major thing: The code, and the Idea to read from text-files using Javascript. i guess you all people familiar with javascript could actually read and understand the code or parts of it.
I think it is totaly unecessary (everthing spelled right so far? ;-) )
I would prefer using other script languages. Server Based! like php or perl. (or asp if you have a windows server).
not just for security reasons. it's just, that f.e. PERL is just made for accessing and manipulating text files. and php comes with such features as well, and is quite easy.. supports a load of databases ... so for what javascript?
------------
GERMAN:
Ihr habt bestimmt alles englische verstanden, oder ihr seid alt und aus der ehem. DDR, oder habt ihr gar die schule nicht besucht? Wird doch bundesweit ab der 5. klasse unterrichtet.... ;-)
------------------
you see, one reason for the janwinkler to write in german is the fact that a complex story can be written in this less text.
smoke:
"... so for what javascript?"
The text describes posibilities how to access to text-files with javascript not because i like to do it with js but because some people asked me how they could do things like that ... so i created the article. As you can read as 'Fazit' (What's this in englis? grrr.) I also don't like to use JS for these things ... ;-)
"Ihr habt bestimmt alles englische verstanden, oder ihr seid alt und aus der ehem. DDR, oder habt ihr gar die schule nicht besucht? Wird doch bundesweit ab der 5. klasse unterrichtet.... "
Was soll das jetzt? Ja, ich komme aus dem Osten, habe aber dennoch mehr als 8 Jahre englischen Unterricht genossen (den es nebenbei auch bei uns gab - man mag es kaum glauben) ...
You can update Flashfiles on the fly using xml to pull out the content from a textfile
You could call it "poor mans CM System".
This could (almost) have been done with actionscripting as well, but the sorting into movieclips would have turned out be a lot more difficult
You can see the result here :
www.dr.dk/orbitalen/tidslinier/
Once you´re there, click the link
"Computerens historie"
(located in the center of the page)
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